#004: Beating the Odds

Updated: Jul 1

There are going to be a few changes here at The Groove Podcast. This episode has a special announcement and updated information on some new and exciting stuff coming up.

Devin Pense (L) and Regie Hamm (R)

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Transcribed Episode


Speaker 1:0:02

You have to take risks. That will be disappointments and failures and disasters as a result of taking these risks. This task was acquainted to you. And if you do not find a way, no one will. Great moments are born from great opportunity. And that's what you have here in the end. That's all we really are just stories. Stories are what our lives are made up of. Stories, how we remember people and stories make us feel a little less alone in the world.

Devin Pense:0:41

What's up everybody? Devin Pense here, The Groove Podcast. And what I'm going to do today is a little bit different. Um, the statistics are that most podcasts, the majority of podcasts never make it past the third episode. And I have currently exactly three episodes on the podcast and I'm here today to announce that I am going to beat the odds we are moving forward and, and moving past. I'm especially excited to announce today that I'm bringing on a cohost, a very dear friend of mine. This guy has already been featured on one of the podcasts that I've had. Um, he is a, I did it for multiple reasons. We've talked about it. I really want this show to be something special. And I felt like that, you know, bringing in a real life, true, bonafide showman, we'll just kind of, you know, take this thing to the next level. And so without further ado, I want to introduce Regie Hamm as the cohost on the group podcast. Regie.

Regie Hamm:1:54

Yeah, I can hear the applause. I can hear it nationwide.

Regie Hamm:2:00

I am a bonofied. I'm a bonafide showman?

Devin Pense:2:02

That's it, man. I coined that phrase for you. So, uh, in all seriousness, man, I am thrilled to death to be doing this with you and that you agreed to do it. I know you've got so many huge things going on and, uh, for you to, uh, jump in here with, with me and take, you know, us together taking this show to a new level. Um, I'm just really excited about it.

Regie Hamm:2:26

Dude. I am, I, I love this. I love this concept. Um, it's like, uh, you know, this is right kind of in my, I'm not going to say, I'm not going to say wheelhouse, but you know, if, if there was, I know it's a phrase, it's an overused phrase, but this is, this is the kind of thing that I think about and write about and talk about and blog about. Um, that, that all, uh, you know, you've got a couple of choices. Albert Einstein said you got two choices in life. You can decide that you live in a hostile universe, that means nothing or you live in a good universe, right? And I think, I think you can extrapolate that out and you can decide, look, all life is pointless or all life has a point in all life has a purpose. And I think this is the kind of stuff we talk about.

Regie Hamm:3:15

We've got a constant text thread going. Um, and we talk about this kind of stuff all the time. We are, we are jaded because we joke about stuff all the time. But, but when it comes down to w, you know, when you told me what you were doing with this podcast, I was like, man, first of all I'd be honored to be on. And then when you asked me to come co-host with you, I was really thrilled because this, because I always thought if I were, if I were going to do a podcast, this is the kind of thing I would do. And talking to people who have, um, been, you know, been up on mountains and down in valleys and have, have really kind of come to quote unquote the groove in their life, but through a series of difficult events and unexpected. I think that's the thing.

Regie Hamm:4:01

It's like, I think sometimes we start out in life thinking we're going to be something and we find as we get into it that, you know, obviously mean and nobody's life turns out like they thought it was going to. And this is really appropriate for you and I to be doing this one, because the way we started out, you know, look, you were going to play drums for Toto. I was gonna play drums for Toto. Um, and I will never forget, I'm just going to jump into our nostalgia here, but I will never forget. Uh, I had a man, I had one, I had one at like a, a talent contest, uh, for our church. And this guy came up to me afterwards and he goes, dude, you better enjoy this while you can because there's a dude from Texas who's about to show up and gonna give you a run for your money. And I was like, Oh, wow, okay. And he was talking about you of course. And, uh, and, and what I didn't know was what I didn't know was that people were telling you the same thing. They were, they, people were already pitting us against each other, you know, and, uh, and I'll never forget when we met on that tennis court, uh, you know, I was mad. I was kinda scared. Like, man, this dude sounds like he's like 10 feet tall. And he's like, you know, uh, and meet you out there. I'm like, Oh man, it's just you. You know, and we, I mean, I, I'm, I don't know if you felt this way down, but I knew immediately we were already friends and we already were over the absurdity of all that stuff. Everybody had that round. Absolutely. Absolutely. [inaudible].

Devin Pense:5:41

And I think if you listen to a Reggie's episode, I mean, you'll hear a lot of our kind of history and background, but you know, we came from a small and we were in a small organization. E I'll be at, it was still fairly small, you know, small world and

Regie Hamm:6:01

church or church organization. Yeah.

Devin Pense:6:04

Organization. Um, yeah, it wasn't the, uh, any other organization.

Speaker 3:6:07

We didn't come from dollar general. It was uh, too bad. Right. That's what we should. So I really wish we'd come from dollar general,

Speaker 1:6:17

better play, no doubt. But no. Yeah, you're right. I mean, it was like a, it's just instant chemistry. And I think there's Ty, you know, we're, we're, we're getting old enough now and there's, you come across so many different people in life, literally as in, uh, of course as the years go by and then accumulates. But there are really only a handful of people if that, um, that there's just a connection with. And a, I think that happened with me and you and, and you're right. Like we have a constant thread going back and forth text thread and, and we, and, and the thing to man is like, we're living this out ourselves. Um, and I think, so we talked about it so much. What I was really hoping to do and wanting to do is just to get it out there. And a lot of times I think creatives, um, artists, we bottle stuff up so much and we're still inside our heads.

Speaker 1:7:14

We're constantly trying to sort things out, work things out. You know, when you're freelance or you're, you know, when you work for yourself or, or what, whatever the case may be, you've got this whole universe in your mind and you can get, you can really kind of get locked in a box. And, and so just being able to get out and talk about it for me, you know, you and I were talking about this kind of, you know, I'm off, I'm going to say a corporate term here offline. Um, please forgive me. We were talking about this and, and it's just, it's more therapy than anything to be honest with you. Um, and the cool thing is, is to, to bring up, you know, bring on different people. There's so many amazing stories out there and I know that's become so overused. I was talking to somebody the other day and we were talking about the amount of content that is out there to be consumed. And if you really think about it, if you think about YouTube or Instagram, um, you know, vine went away, but you know, tick tock is, you know, hanging around Snapchat, whatever you, whatever it may be. Facebook, man, I don't know what the, the stats are or if there was a, some kind of a weird graph that could show it, but there's so much content out there, it's impossible for everyone to like consume that content. Well, you, you

Speaker 3:8:40

can't, I mean it's, I, I, I read a, uh, article about a month ago, uh, this guy who's a music, you know, music head and, and that's where I make most of them are. Well, I used to make a living in music. Uh, I still think I do, but you know, I still do all this stuff you're supposed to do to make a living. It's just that they don't pay me anymore. Uh, but this guy, you know, was, I was reading some stuff in one of the trades and this guy had done some statistical analysis of how much music is out there and how much and what his age was and how much he listened to music at, you know, how many hours a day, whatever. Anyway, he basically, you know, his conclusion was, what I've realized is I don't have enough life left. This is mathematical. It's not just like a feeling, but he did the math on it.

Speaker 3:9:33

I don't have enough life left to listen to everything that comes out every year. Wow. There it goes. There's that much of it. Now that's a, the, I kind of shuttered at that and it's like, yeah, you know, we're all fighting to be heard and be seen and, you know, um, and in that world, how does anybody feel special? You know, there, there was probably a time when, you know, a record label executive could look at somebody like Frank Sinatra, you know, chomp his cigar and say, everybody in the world's gonna hear you kid. And, and it might be true, you know, there might be room in everybody's life to listen to Frank Sinatra or Elvis or whoever. Now, it doesn't matter who the biggest star in the world is. There may not be enough room in everybody's life to hear them. That's crazy, man. You know, that's, that's a, that's an interesting thing to think about.

Speaker 3:10:28

There's so many of us, but everybody's creating something that I think that everybody should, I, I believe everybody does have a story. At, my father told me one time, he said, you know, we've, we've done my story, you know, one of your podcasts and one of the first three episodes, and people can go back and listen to that. But my dad and I were talking about, he said, you know, son, you gotta, you've got an amazing story. And I said, dad, I think everybody does. I just, they may not know how to write it right. You know, but, but they, but they've got one,

Speaker 1:10:56

but they do. And I, and I think they may not know how to ride it or express it. Um, but I think about my parents and I use them as an example. You know, they're, they're in their seventies and I think about, it just baffles my mind. I think about them as teenagers. Kids, you know, they, you know, one, if they're lucky, one phone in the house, you know, the really long cord or one television, black and white or whatever. And they lived that man. And now my mom is like an emoji expert on Facebook. That's the only way she communicates by, you know, little heart eyes. You know, a little sparkly. This, you know, means gifts, you know, like, you know, it's like, that's how she communicates with me now. I'm like, she doesn't even use her words anymore.

Speaker 3:11:47

The technology is so user friendly. It does not take long to figure it out. I, my son was four, I think, four or five when we brought the first iPad home and he, he's babbling through the house and he sees it. He goes, whose iPad is that? And I said, well, how do you know what an iPad is? Not? You gotta remember that it had just come out? Yeah, yeah. He goes, I know what I know what iPad is, you know, and uh, he said, can I play on it? And I said, sure. You know, and now this was my iPad. Right, right. But he said, can I play on it now? Okay. I promise you Devin, three hours later he's sitting in his room, rare back on his pillow. Dad, I need your password. You know, he's already downloading stuff. He's already swiping stuff. I never got it again. It's, it's his, it became his iPad, you know? So it, it, but it doesn't just happen with our kids. It happens with our parents. Yeah.

Speaker 1:12:44

Some people love Steve jobs, some, some people hate him. He has his, you know, his philosophy, you know, in some of his, you know, writings and some of the things that you've, that I've seen and read about him, you know, having the ability to invent something or dream something up or think about something that people don't even know that they need is baffles my mind. And in a sense, in a sense, that's what he did, you know?

Speaker 3:13:15

Well, let's turn it. That's true. Genius. I mean, that's true genius. You know, that's, that's someone who's looking around corners that the rest of us aren't looking around. And um, I mean, just speaking, I mean, I don't, I'm not here to just talk about my son, but my son was asking me why, why are there more pictures of my sister on the walls than me and I? I said, well, some of it is because of the iPhone your sister got here. There were no I-phones. So we actually had cameras and you had to go to the store and get the proofs and look at the pictures and then you framed them. I said, there's way more pictures of you than your sister, but they're all in this little machine right here. That's a great,

Speaker 1:13:58

great safe man.

Speaker 3:14:01

Balanced balance, balance, balanced love in the house, right? Yes. That's the story.

Speaker 1:14:06

Do you blame it on the iPhone? But it's true. You're absolutely right. And, and I, you know, my son, uh, has a, has a son now. Um, I guess you would,

Speaker 3:14:16

I would call it, that makes you a grandfather, Devin.

Speaker 1:14:19

I was going to try to find another term, but now I'm super proud of that. And you know, it, it's, it's different with him. Like everything is in the iPhone, everything, all their pictures, you know, it's just like, that's where, that's where it is. And, and when we were growing up, it was like you said, I mean it was, or even when my kids were small, I mean it was, I had cameras and you know, you go to develop it, you take the pictures and you know, she 72 pictures and you go to Walgreens and you know, I can remember going

Speaker 3:14:50

and you four of them are good.

Speaker 1:14:52

You know what I mean? You hope a point where I think it was Walgreens that had the, uh, uh, policy where, you know, like if they didn't come out, you only paid for the ones that weren't flux. So you're like, you're going through your pictures like, Nope, that one's not good, that one's not good.

Speaker 3:15:06

And that's a really sketchy business model, man. You gotta let the customer decide what they're going to pay for. Yeah. You got the young kid there behind the counter judging like, no, I think that one's good now. I'm like, no, but AI, not to my standards, young man.

Speaker 1:15:22

But I think, going back to what you said earlier, you know, and it, and I wonder, you know, about your, you were talking about true genius, you know, I wonder how many true geniuses over the course of time have been, you know, shooed away into a dark space and, and fell into deep state of depression and just never, just because they were, you know, squashed down. I have this kind of theory, um, that I kind of talked to my kids about as they were growing up and talking to them about, you know, growing into, you know, mannerly young men and moving forward in the world and not, not just kind of staying with the status quo. Um, I always talked to them in terms of, you know, guys, there's what I call the gray matter crowd and you're going to over different times in your life, you're going to want to move forward. You are going to move forward, you are going to have opportunities. Um, but for some reason, you know, in general human nature, people don't like to see other people succeed. I mean, yeah, and I don't, I don't mean that just broadly, you know, giant, broad stroke. I mean, of course there are some people, but you know,

Speaker 3:16:39

well it's, it upsets your, it, it upsets your, your, the, the way you've organized your life. Dude. I a lady you used to work for ms Oprah Winfrey said this very eloquently. People, people get uncomfortable when you exceed their expectations. Yes. They've put, they've put you somewhere that they decided a long time ago when they met Devin Pence, they decided what Devin Pence was. That's right. And, and this is how it, and then now they can organize their life around, okay, I know, I know. Okay, now I can put him over here cause I know what he is. Right. And then all of a sudden Devin Pence comes along and says, wait a minute, I'm away away more than that. I'm this and I'm missing. I'm that now. Now I have to reorganize my entire life because I didn't expect him to be also to be able to do that. Right?

Speaker 1:17:23

Like what am I supposed to do with that? And yeah. And, and it's been interesting and I was talking to them as they were younger and I kind of stuck with it and stuck with it. And as they've gotten older and they've experienced life and they've gone through things, which is the only way you can get any kind of, you know, life is to go through it. And they would call me up, you know, which I love the fact that they're able to do call me up and kinda, you know, like dad, you know, just talk to me about some, you know, what they're going through and things. And I often refer back to that and I say, God, you know, you remember when I was talking about the gray matter crowd. Yeah. Now you do, you wonder why that person is trying to, you know, talk behind your back or do something to try to keep you from moving forward or you don't understand why somebody is just like coming down on you like that. You know, it's, it's people, people are hurting and usually it's the ones that are hurting the most at lash out the most. That's absolutely right. And they don't. And it's so, it's just very interesting too to think about, um, us as humans as what we were talking about earlier with all the content where there's so many, everybody's a content creator at this point.

Speaker 3:18:37

Well, I, I, I want to go back to something you said earlier because I think it's, it's really the pertinent part to me at least from my perspective of what I want to see out of the show. But how many, you said how many true geniuses have been squelched and pushed aside. And there's an, I think everybody, I really believe this. I think everybody has the potential for true genius. I think human beings are star children, man. I think we've got, there's some kind of divinity in us. I mean, you go see skyscrapers and you go listen to a Beethoven symphony and you go, you know, look at the American interstate in the, in the, in, in, in air travel, and just the things that we have achieved. I mean, and we're going to get into a lot of this stuff, you know, on some of these episodes, but it's, it's mind boggling.

Speaker 3:19:27

And it's, it's wonderful if you, if you see it that way. Um, and I think it's, if people can find their true self, if they can get to the center of who they actually are, uh, it, you know, another Einstein quote, you know, everybody's a genius. But if you try to ask a fish to climb a tree, uh, you know, it's not, you're gonna, you're gonna think the fish is an idiot. The fish is not an idiot. The fish's just not equipped to climb a tree. And I think the whole thing is finding what you're equipped to do. And I think throughout history and the, you know, the whole thing about the individual, I mean that's, I'm really into that. Um, finding your, finding your, your center and your space as an individual. You're, you're, you've got your own set of fingerprints, man. You, you got, you've got something special to bring the world.

Speaker 3:20:18

And when we look through history and we see things like the Holocaust and we see things like slavery and we see things like human trafficking, and I just, I kind of cry for humanity because I think, man, what, what kind of potential was wasted? It let's, let's, let's ask ourselves, if we had never had slavery, could we have cured cancer by now? Right. You know what I mean? Could we, could we be teleporting by now? You know, one of those kids that was born a plantation probably held the key to some kind of quantum leap for mankind, but instead he was picking strawberries, you know? Yeah. Um, uh, someone right now as being human trafficked and being, you know, uh, raped by some kind of coyote or some kind of, and maybe in that little girl's mind or that little boy's mind or some or something, there is the, there is the key to the next step of human development.

Speaker 3:21:14

There's the key to the next place we need to go. So I, I just, I, I feel like that's a wonderful thing we can talk about on this show. And I hope that people who listen, understand, it's not just about the guests. It's not just about me, it's not just about Devin. But what I hope is that all the guests that listen will think about their own life and, and think that, you know, you may think you're in a mundane job. You think you may think you're in a dead end in life, but you're not, man, you're here for a reason. You're there, there, there's a, there's a spark inside you and in it, look, it might, there's nothing wrong with working at Macy's. There's nothing wrong with, you know, delivering pizzas. There's nothing, any of all that stuff is fine. And I don't, I'm not saying that you're destined to be the next Steve jobs, but that, but you do have an impact on everybody around you.

Speaker 3:22:09

And I think that's it. That's it. It's getting to that going, you know what, man, I work here at the, at the counter, at Macy's, but I don't just have to be an hourly employee that clocks in and clocks out. I can make a real difference right here. Absolutely. You know, I mean, I know, I know that sounds like Pollyanna, you know, pie in the sky. But I honestly, dude, I honestly believe that. I think it just depends on how you approach what it is you're about to do and recognize it. Man, I have a right to be here. I'm, I'm as I'm as important as anybody on the planet. And, and now it's time for me to figure out what that is.

Speaker 1:22:46

Yeah. And I don't think it's Pollyanna. I mean I think there's been so many examples of, of this, you know, and I think, you know, you'll hear me talk a lot on this show about movies cause that's what I relate to. I watch a lot of movies, but you know, the, you know, the easy one is the matrix. When you look at the overall theme of the matrix. I mean, that's what, that's kind of what you're talking about. And you'll probably hear me say this on multiple episodes, hopefully not every episode, but you know, just recently, my wife, you know, she loves eighties movies and I don't, and so a lot of times she'll watch him. Yes. And, and she asks me always like, Oh, you know, she just watched this movie, it's so great. And I'm like, Aw man, the music, I can't, you know, so forth and so on.

Speaker 1:23:31

But there was one, I finally sat down with her one, uh, the other night and we watched, uh, of Joe versus the volcano to Tom Hanks movie. And it's basically just really quickly, it's, it's about this guy has this saying, you know, this mundane job, he works in a lube factory, you know, it's like it, and he's in the marketing department of a lube factory. And so his boss is just like this, you know, a just kind of sell itself really does mean you can buy it. And you know, 20 gallon buckets on Amazon now. But, but you know, his boss was just like always, you know, up up his bud on stuff and just, you know, it's his office. It was just so much, it's right there, it's so over done like, you know, fluorescent lighting. And he was so miserable and he was sick all the time and everything was gloom and doom.

Speaker 1:24:22

And he basically was diagnosed as, you know, with some sort of what they call a brain fog or whatever, and he thought he was going to die basically. And so he's like, well, you know what the heck I, I'll just, you know, I'm outta here. And so he decides to quit his job in, in his big exit scene as he was quitting his job, taking his, you know, stuff knocking stuff over. He threw out this quote, this line, which is one of my favorite, you know, any kind of, the last thing he said to his boss before he left was, I've been afraid to live my life. So I sold it to you for $300 a week. Yeah, that's a great line. You know, and whoever wrote that, I don't know who the writer was, but I mean, and if you think about that for a second, you know, and what you said earlier, I, I can raise my hand and the first one to say it, it's like I have sold so much of my life because I was maybe afraid to go out and do something or create something or to put something in the world that I created that I was afraid to put out there.

Speaker 3:25:29

Well, I did, I mean, I lived this, I, I, I wrote songs for publisher, you know, for publishing companies and for other artists for years. And I, I've actually been thinking about this a lot lately. I, I went through some years where I didn't think about it much, but I lately really been thinking about it a lot. Um, and the most interesting songs that I've written happened when I decided to just kind of jettison all that and go, you know what, I, man, I'm going to make my own record and I'm going to do it the way I want to do it in the way I hear it in my head. And I don't, I don't really hear music the way these people hear it, that they're fine and it's, it's wonderful and I'm glad that they're honoring me by recording my songs, but I don't really hear music this way.

Speaker 3:26:23

I hear it this way and that long, you know, that started me as a recording artist and this isn't like a shameless plug. I'm just, I think it relates to what we're saying. I, I can tell you those are the songs I do and shows and those are the songs that touch people and those are the songs touch me. And it, it turned me around completely as an artist where I go, man, I don't know that I'll ever really go back to just kind of selling my craft for money, you know? Yeah. I come, come right with me. I can help you write a hit song for your record. I decided, I just realized I'm not, I'm, I'm more than that. I'm something else. Uh, I might be something that you can't really categorize and that's where we all are. You know, we all are something you can't categorize.

Speaker 3:27:17

If we have the, the guts to step out and go, Hey, hang on a second. I kinda think we should do it this way or I want to do it this way. I really do believe our society is kind of getting there. I think we celebrate so much diversity and individualism and all that, but then at the same time, we also have this culture online and on social media that really shames people for thinking differently sometimes. Right. And you know, so, so while we're celebrating, you know, diversity, sometimes it's like, well, it's diversity. If, if it's this kind of diversity, you know, which isn't diversity at all. You know, I, I've always, I always tell people, if you put it diversity is diversity of thought. Okay. If you, if you walk in a room and you have two black women and four white guys and two, uh, Indian, uh, gentlemen and three a women of native native American descent and you know, and someone in a wheelchair and you know, just nay. And, and, and in to people in their eighties and a person who's 17, you think you're walking into a room of diversity, but if they all think the same way, it isn't diversity, right? It's just a room full of people who look different and are different ages.

Speaker 1:28:47

That's true. And, and I, you know, I'll throw this guy's name out and, and, and may get some haters or not, but because he's a polarizing guy, but Jordan, there's guy Jordan Peterson, um, yeah. You know, he had, he, he threw out something on a Joe Rogan podcast. Uh, that, that, that I think is that I resonated with at least. And I think that in general society, and I'm not saying everyone of course, but we're losing our, our identities, our self identities. And what happens, what begins to happen, and I'm going to butcher this, um, the way he said it, but basically when you lose your, your, your, uh, yourself, your self identity, the identity of yourself and who you really are and what you really personally believe in, and you start identifying with groups of people who have a belief, then you lose your sense of identity and begin to take on the group's sense of identity. And then that's what becomes a lot of times in society what you just mentioned it, you know, a large group of people who have, you know, this overarching idea and not everyone in the group might buy into what the group is saying and, and you just kind of, people lose, I think their voice a lot of times.

Speaker 3:30:08

And w when it comes tribal, it's just tribal at that point. Yeah.

Speaker 1:30:12

Yeah. And I think it's human nature, but I also think it's, it's a shame, you know, that, that, and it's easy. It's very easy to do. Um, when, and there's 1,000,000,001 factors that come into play here, you know, and you know, we're kind of talking in, in global terms a little bit, but cause you know, there's all sorts of factors that come into play then, you know, economic status or how you're grown, you know, how you grew up, these various things and, and kinda what you relate to or how you gravitate to. And I think that's why we see on social media, everyone crying out in a way of like, look at this ham sandwich I just ate or I'm about to eat, or whatever it is. Or like I'm, I'm, you know, Oh, look at, you know, another picture of me inside a tent with my feet hanging out over a mountain range. You know, like,

Speaker 3:31:04

this is the situation today. That's my favorite. Yeah. Yeah. And my office today, you know? Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1:31:12

That kind of stuff. Um, and I just, I have found myself in the business of, of that, you know, I, I've been in the marketing and promo business for the majority of my career and it's been everything from television to, you know, ad agency things. I've sat in rooms and heard people argue over, you know, potato chips, you know, for hours. And, and, and I think that even myself in the business who has a production company and looking at, looking at the, at the landscape going, which way am I supposed to go? Yeah. Because it the way, you know, what am I supposed to create here that it's going to get any kind of, you know, I notice, you know, cause you know, if you look at, you know, Phi, even five years ago in the documentary space, if you were a filmmaker and you wanted to, you know, a genuine filmmaker, you wanted to go out and make a documentary on something really great, really cool. And you went to an investor and you're like, Oh, why do you want, I want to make a documentary slam, you know, don't let the door hit your butt. On the way out, you know. But honestly, I, you know, I'll credit, you know, Netflix for this. Um, I feel like that, you know, the documentary is making its way back and now it's a, it's a way of, you know, people are accepting them more. They're telling us stories

Speaker 3:32:36

is more [inaudible]. I mean, I think the stats out that more people watch docks on, on Netflix than anything else. I mean that, that's, that's the thing. And dude, I believe it's because people are really trying to get to the truth of things. Right. And the, and the, they want to see, I, I've said this for a couple of years now, but you know, we've seen Elvis man knew. Now we want to see his bedroom. You know, we want, we want to see his closet, we want to see, you know, a day in the life we, we seen him on stage. Yeah, we get that. But that's not what we want to see now. You know, we want to see Elvis when he's, you know, popping pills and, and shooting the TV screens out. That's what we want to see. That's the interesting part because we've seen the artifice, you know, we've, we, we get that.

Speaker 3:33:22

Uh, but, and dude, I'll, I'll even credit, uh, uh, an unlikely person in this, I think Taylor Swift in some ways has been a trailblazer in that regard, in that, you know, one of the first like mega bonafide household names superstars who'll just tweet her fans back. You know, like you can, you can tweet to Taylor and she'll tweet you back. You know, uh, that, you know, that everybody used to be kind of behind the curtain, you know, all the stars used to be behind the curtain wall. That doesn't now you gotta you got to do little Facebook lives and you gotta do Instagram things. Us cooking in the kitchen and, you know, we want to see that you're a real person. And I think people in the bigger, in the bigger sense, people are trying to get to the real story of humanity. It's like, okay, what is writing? Ryan Reynolds and I aren't that, aren't that different. I mean, he's in great shape, but, and he's an idiot. He's a multimillionaire, but he's got the same kind of problems I've got that makes it, that makes us all feel connected and you know, and, and

Speaker 1:34:28

if I could just jump in here, I would, I would gladly take Ryan Reynolds problems.

Speaker 3:34:34

But yeah, no doubt about it. But you know what? Yeah, I know what you mean. If we talk to Ryan Reynolds, I'll guarantee you there's a backstory there that, you know, that's not as pretty as it looks, you know, onscreen

Speaker 1:34:49

well, and I think to your point, like if you look at the way society

Speaker 3:34:52

and Ryan Reynolds, if you're listening, give us a call, we'd love to have you on the show. Yes,

Speaker 1:34:56

please. You, you have my number. Um, you know, to your point, the way it's gone over the past 20, 30 years, I mean, the way people consumed, the way people got their news, you know, from the early days of newspapers and then it was television and you know, three networks and, and in, in so limited all the way to, Oh, you know, the Russians are messing, you know, deciding our elections. And you know, there's fake news here, fake news there, all that kind of stuff. It's, the floodgates are open man. And that's, yeah, I think that's, I don't know, it's, to me it's, I'll this not, it might sound a little quirky, but it scares me a little bit to be honest with you. What's going on?

Speaker 3:35:43

Well, the thing about it is you can't trust anything anymore. It's like a, you know, from what I understand about the, the Russian situation, I, they, they kinda tried to sow discord with, with both parties and both camps. And they would put out fake news story here that favored this side and put, put a fake news story at that favor that side. And I do think, and I'm actually kind of fascinated by this dev, because I, it seems like we were raised to be a little more analytical to think a little more analytically than, than people are thinking now. And maybe I'm wrong about that, but when I see a new story online, I don't necessarily just automatically believe that it's true. I, you know what I mean? It's like, or if I see a video, uh, I very often, I don't ever repeat repost videos unless it's something funny or something uplifting or whatever.

Speaker 3:36:44

But I don't ever repost anything that's like politically charged, like right off the bat because I'm thinking to myself, man, I don't know where the context of this is. I don't know what happened before this. I don't know what happened after this. Um, and I, I'm fascinated by it, by friends that I have who are smart, educated people who are just so quick to post something. And it's like, man, you, you haven't verified this. You don't know if this is true or not. And now we're getting to the point where even our, even our kind of blue chip, quote unquote blue chip media outlets like the Washington post and the New York times and these things that we always thought were sort of Bulletproof, they'll post things that may or may not be true. Yeah. And, and it's, people are just rushing to like a, you know, we've got a bolster our side of things.

Speaker 3:37:34

And I think, I think human, the human story lives in the, uh, you know, the, the, they always say the truth is kind of in the middle somewhere. And I think that's where the human story actually lives. You know, I don't think it lives on the fringes, on the edges. It's like what you were talking about before. We always feel like we got to run and find a tribe and it's like, man, my, my son was asking me, uh, we were driving somewhere, I think we were on a road trip. And, um, you know, he's, he's 12. He's, he's paying attention to political things and whatever, and he wants to see what my take is. And he said, dad, do you do you like president Trump? And um, I said, well, I don't know president Trump. He goes, Oh, well, you know what I mean?

Speaker 3:38:17

Do you like him as a president? I said, well, I like some things he does and some things he does I don't like. And he didn't, you know, that was a complicated answer. He wanted yes or no? Did you like president Obama? I said, buddy, I don't know president. He goes, Oh, well I'm, you know what I mean? Did you, him as a president? I said, well, I, I liked some things. Here were some policies I didn't like, and we talked about the policies, but I could, you know, it's like he's trying to get a, he's trying to get a stance here and, and I was trying to teach him that sometimes life is a little more complicated than that. And it's a little more nuanced than that. And when you S particularly when you go into a voting booth, here's the thing, you know, people always have to remember, you've got two choices and it's not like an Al a carte menu. You can't say, okay, well I'll take this person. But I would like a touch of that. I'd like a little Kennedy and I'd like a little rig in and I'd like a little, uh, just a pitch of, of, of do IDI, isn't that right? You just don't get that. You get,

Speaker 1:39:19

and, and, and one of our upcoming shows, um, maybe we'll get to that point when we can sort of DNA splice.

Speaker 3:39:26

Yeah. We could splice a, the perfect candidate, I think. I think that's, that's what we do. But, but [inaudible] so that's just the political world. But I think, you know, the entire world is that way. And I think that's why you have to man Sting's got a great quote, uh, all this time, eh, you know the song all this time, men go crazy and congregations, but they only get better one by one. Yep. Yep. And that is so true. It's like you gotta take people as they come individually. And I don't, I just, I kind of to a point in my life where I can't just write someone off wholesale, uh, you know, based on, you know, what they look like based on, you know, what, who they voted for, blah, blah, blah. Everybody's got a story and they all come to the place in their life where they are for a reason. You know, there, there are reasons behind why people vote a certain way and why they like a certain kind of music and why, why S a celebrity will emerge, you know, why they like a certain movie or, uh, you know, there's, there's reasons for all that.

Speaker 1:40:30

Yeah. And I, I do think that, you know, it's, I said it a little bit earlier, I get a little worried at times, you know, and I, I still have faith in humanity, don't get me wrong, but there is a giant wave of sort of this purest idealism, um, you know, pick your poison, pick your side. Doesn't matter who it is. But the fact of the matter is, you know, flawed people can still do good things. We're all flawed, you know, I mean,

Speaker 3:41:00

Oh my gosh, no, wait.

Speaker 1:41:02

You know, we have this, everyone has something, but that doesn't mean that they can't do good. People can still do good. And I think there's, it's, it's in us, we just have to figure it out. Now there are some very bad people out there. I don't, you know, disclaimer, but in general, that's what I'm talking about. Well,

Speaker 3:41:22

that's right. And I, I mean, I listen, you know, you don't, that what I'm saying doesn't mean you have to like everybody. It doesn't mean you have to do business with everybody. It doesn't mean you have to be over by, you know, people, uh, I, I'll tell you this too, and dude, you, okay? So we're both raised by preachers, um, who were raised by preachers. I mean, dude, it goes way deep with us. And one of the things that I think people kind of forget about the Bible that I'm, I know your dad, uh, preached this way and my dad preached this way and it always, it brought it to life for me, is that if you look at it first and foremost as a story, rather than like a set of rules and regulations, but just look at it as a story. Look at if you read some of these stories, I mean, these people were flawed human beings. They were trying to figure it out and not figuring it out. Most of the time, you know, I mean, you look, look at the story of David. Oh man. I mean that, that dude should be a, I mean, today, not only would he be considered a womanizer and a murder, I mean, he'd be behind bars. I mean, you know, that they, we wouldn't, we wouldn't put up with a David today. He's the only person in the Bible called a man after God's own heart. Right.

Speaker 1:42:43

And yeah, and yet as a King, uh, you know, it's like we'll see if our King still alive, if we'll put women in his bed, if he's still [inaudible],

Speaker 3:42:52

you know, it's kind of like, it's, it's the tried and true method dev. He's he alive, get three 18 year olds and put them in there, write that down, make them, make them go in naked. You know, it's, it's like a Simpsons episode. I mean, you know, this is true, right? His home are still, his home are still alive. Put three naked, 18 year old girls in his bed and see, I mean, that's what they did, you know?

Speaker 1:43:14

Right. That's right. And, and,

Speaker 3:43:16

and that's a, I mean, if you, if you read it that way, if you understand the Bible as, as this just like mind blowing story, it's fascinating and it in it. And it gives me kind of hope, you know, that like you said, damn. I mean, no matter how flawed you are, no matter what your problems are, you know, there's a reason for you to be here and you can still do good. I mean, I, I look at David as an example, but man, there's a ton of them, you know?

Speaker 1:43:46

Oh, there's a ton of them. And I think on, on as we kind of wrap up here, you know, what we want to do is bring people on. And a lot of times it'll probably just be me and you know, you know, me and Reggie, um, cause we, we just, we just like to talk, but sometimes we have to realize that, you know, some stories have sad endings and that that has to be okay. Sometimes, you know, and not every story is a success. We're all striving to get to that place. We all learn every day. Um, you know, but a lot of the things that I feel like I need to talk about and you know, just some of the things that, you know, you and I talk about a lot are just, you know, you know, fighting through or just working through the process, the process of stuff that you and I go through and we won't get into it until the, into this episode. But, you know, you guys will hear us talk about projects or things that, that Reginae or you know, individually are trying to do or get accomplished and you just, you know, it's just this feeling of like, Oh, it's done when we finally got it. Oh, well, no, it's not done. Or

Speaker 3:44:58

dude, that happened to me today. You know, the deal.

Speaker 1:45:01

Yeah. And it's just one of those things where it's like, at what point do you, you know, do you decide to give up or do you, you know, not give up? Or how, how many bouts of depression or anxiety can one person take? Um, where is the, you know, where is it? And I really think it boils down to the moments that we have in front of us. And what I've been really trying to do a lot lately is flip the script on just my thinking in terms of I've, I've kind of always had this thought pattern of like, you know, when I, when I direct my first film, my first meeting, I'm going to really be happy and then I'm going to be able to, you know, take vacations and I'm going to do all of this, these other things. And, and it's just the opposite. I mean, I've got to learn to be happy with what's happening in my life, you know, and it, those other things will come and it's just, it's an interesting world that we live in. You know, that's all, it's just kind of, it's just interesting. And you'll hear us talk a lot about that.

Speaker 3:46:09

Well, I w I, I would like to say this, uh, in this broadcast we have used the word wheelhouse. We have used the word offline and flip the script. So I'd like to apologize for those three close days we've used,

Speaker 1:46:23

hopefully there'll be filtered out by, uh, by the corporate filter.

Speaker 3:46:28

Yeah, I have, it's no way they're letting us get through that, but no, you're right dude. I mean, finding the groove in your life I don't think is a, this is gonna sound weird, but I think it's true. I don't think it says much about success as much as it's about kind of, um, a SIG, finding significance, you know, find finding, uh, finding yourself, your center and, and then how you relate and how you're relating to people and how you're affecting people. I will tell you real, real quickly, uh, my wife started a new job. I've been working like a little part time job over the summer just to break in, bring in some extra money. One of the things that we both talk about all the time together when we come home, when we talk about, you know, what's going on at these jobs, uh, is the absolute constant barrage of the people around us needing to talk about person or that person.

Speaker 3:47:31

Now. Well, when you meet so-and-so, I mean, they're there, they're the nice guy, but I just need to tell you. But you know, and it, and, and I, and I, I told her, I said, I'm, I'm waiting on the first person to not do that. And, and there, there were none, you know, and she said the same thing. She goes, I'm really, I'm really waiting to meet the first person who doesn't have something bad to say about somebody and that I think that's when you haven't found your groove, man. Yeah. You know, that that's where, that's where you're still, when you're still looking for the groove in. And I think once you find it, you realize you, you, you cut people Slack. You realize that man, it isn't about the fact, you know, the thing that Randy didn't do that he should have done it. I'm here to help. I'm here for a reason. Let me see if I can pick up the Slack for Randy. You know, let me, let me see if I can help him. And I, I think that's when you're finding the groove, that's when you're making a difference. That's when you're really making a difference with people around you. They will notice it. Trust me.

Speaker 1:48:32

Yeah. And it's, and it's the whole individual thing. It's, it's in, the sad part of that is, is there are people like that, and when you run across them, many times they become the target. You know, it's like, wait a minute, that guy's just re or that girl, that girl is just really nice, like plus her problem. You know what I mean? It's kinda like, what, what is wrong? You know, what's wrong with that person? And, and I had been conditioned to that, you know, being in and out of the corporate world, you know, um, throughout my career, when you go in, it's kinda like you've just kinda got these your guard up and you're just kind of waiting, you know, and it's, it's that whole gray matter crowd thing I was talking about. And then you come across people who are just genuine people in and you're almost expecting them to like, you know, start piling onto somebody. Um, or somebody will come in a room and, and actually be a real jerk about something and they'll walk out. And I've been in rooms with people where no one's like, man, you know, he, he must really be having a bad day. I hope everything's okay, you know, at home or whatever. And it's almost like silver refreshing but shocking at the same time. You know? So it's, it's,

Speaker 3:49:47

and that's a, that's a really hard thing to find in yourself. Especially when someone is, is, is attacking you or they're, you know, they're being a jerk to you. It's really, it's a very difficult to, to get past that initial getting your back up to, man, what is it? Are you okay? Well, there's says that they may not be okay.

Speaker 1:50:07

And you know, advising in my life, my personal life [inaudible] at the moment. And the, one of the hardest things you can do when someone is attacking you is just to not say anything. And now the look at the same time sometimes, you know, sometimes there's two lines, the sand and it's time to stand and fight. Well, that's right. But there's also this, this inciting mentality of like, I'm going to plant another mind here for you. I'm going to plant one here and you're going to step on that one and you're going to blow up and you're going to embarrass yourself. And then I'm, you know, gonna improve, everything's going to be right. And you know, that's just, it's, it's very difficult to navigate these waters. But, so going back to something you said earlier, I think everybody has something entertaining to offer now. I don't, I'm not big on Facebook, you know, I mean you've got a, an amazing Facebook following and I always enjoy, you know, reading your stuff and, and your Facebook live that you do on Wednesdays, but there are certain people now granted you can choose.

Speaker 1:51:19

He, you know, who you pick for your friends and all that kind of stuff. And, and I got off Facebook for a long time, for a while, but I got back on. But there are a few people that I follow on Facebook, if that's what you even call it now. I don't know if your friend, your follow them or your friends or something like that. They're not songwriters, film makers, uh, you know, artists, uh, you know, you know, not to over glorify that. Don't, I'm just saying that because you know, that's what you and I relate to at the moment. They're just, you know, you know, there's people having their, their jobs just like I have my job just like you have your job, but the stuff that they post is so freaking hilarious, you know what I mean? And, and it can be little things that they, they have cold or, or found somewhere.

Speaker 1:52:06

Uh, there's this got one guy that, that th that I follow, um, I won't mention his name. This guy is like, and he's not, uh, in the entertainment business. Okay. So he, he's not in the entertainment business, but he posts so consistently and it's every day and it's just these like old, like articles from the 60s or weird picture from the 70s, or I don't know where he gets this stuff, but it's entertaining. It entertains me, you know, and other people who are just, they post things that are just, they honestly make me laugh out loud and so,

Speaker 3:52:46

well I think, I think in some ways that's a gift. And you know, that's, that's why I'm not averse, uh, to social media. I think if it's done right and people understand kind of what it's for, it isn't, it isn't designed to win a political battle or a religious battle. That's not, that's not what its design is. I think it's designed is to be quick clips and, and, and funny things or insightful things or, or informational things, uh, things maybe someone hasn't thought about, you know. Um, and then look, I've got a blog. The, I personally do it is, I, I try to keep everything tight and, and, and, and a pithy and everything on my posts. And then I've got a blog that I do and if you want to hear me do a deeper dive into something or you want to read that, then you can go to the blog or not.

Speaker 3:53:42

I'm not bothering people with it all the time. It's just, okay, this is my little side over here and this is where I do my rants and this is what I think about this and that. And, and you don't have to go there or you can go there. But when I'm, when I'm posting on social media, it's, it, I, I'm not trying to bleed for you, right. You know, I mean, I, I mean we're just, we're going to keep it light. We're going to fist bump and it's going to be, you know, fun and, and uh, and pithy and, and I like it. And if people, you know, if you call, if you cultivate and curate, uh, a friends group like that, it can really be fun and it can really be lively. And I, I love a lot of them. I'm with you. I've got a lot of great friends and I read wall in the morning when mom, my son's waiting on the bus, I'll sit on the steps and my wife reads her Ritter's and drinks coffee. And a lot of times my day gets brightened man, cause somebody will post something really kind of cool or, or funny or uplifting and it's like, you know, that's, that's kinda what it's for.

Speaker 1:54:44

Well, yeah and I think it's all about what I love about your blogs is the fact that, I mean, you cover a vast, you know, uh, amount of subject matter and, and it really, you come at things at an angle that it, it opens up conversations and, and I know you well enough to know that you write certain things, certain ways to sort of insight conversation with people and to open up a dialogue because if people don't start talking, they, you know, it's just this all out crazy. You know, the dark side of the social media thing, the bullying and the, you know, the coming in and the saying this and, and just, you know, blowing up at one another. Um, but, but there is a, there is a space for that. And one thing that I really want to talk about and, and you know, implement on the show is opening up a dialogue with people. Um, it's not going to be just about me and Reggie talking to one another or guests. We want to open up to the, to our community. And as I said in one episode, that community consists of two people at the moment. Your mother and my mother, hopefully, you know the four of us. Okay.

Speaker 3:56:02

My mom's, my mom's still on the fence. I don't know bro. She's still,

Speaker 1:56:05

she hasn't subscribed, man. Not quite yet. Oh man. We've gotta we've got to work on her but in our, and not, you know, in our, on our Patrion, uh, community, we really want to open up some, some dialogue and even bring some, bring some people, bring you guys in on some, on the creative process, know some things, some things that you want us to talk about and to some guests maybe that you want us to have on or some subjects that you want us to cover. The goal here is to open up the conversation, um, and spread the love just to spread the love even more. Check out Reggie's blog. Um, it's what, where is it Reggie? Blah, blah, blah. Yeah,

Speaker 3:56:44

well it's, it's on my own patriotic side. It's blah blah blogger. It's, it's Patrion dot. Blah blah blogger. Um, but I also released one a week on a, on my WordPress site, um, and that is, um, Reggie ham.com.

Speaker 1:56:58

Yeah. And then every Wednesday night, correct me if I'm wrong yup. At 6:00 PM central time. Yeah. Reggie goes live on Facebook and it's become one of those things where, I mean, Reggie and I talk like little old women on texting all day long. We've been friends for all these years and if, if I'm at all able to, if I'm not shooting or something, I'll always try to, you know, to join in. And when I do, it's just a great, great little format that he's put together. Jump on there. Um, you know, go on Facebook, follow Reggie ham and join in there Wednesday nights with him. It's, it's really great. He talks about his blog and then he plays music and it's just kind of an all around really kind of cool community and it's a variety show. It is a variety show

Speaker 3:57:54

and you always love me a softball. You know what I mean? You always get me to comment. Economic softball. I love it.

Speaker 1:57:59

Uh, but there's a lot of good, a lot of good people who are looking for things. There are billion and 10 books of how to do every possible thing that you can think of, but no one's gonna. You know, we can all read these books, people, I mean, stop. Please stop writing books on how to be happy. I mean, enough.

Speaker 3:58:21

Oh my gosh. I have, I've, I've, okay. I'm five chapters into my new book. How to be happy. Oh my gosh. I'm just saying it like no one, it is.

Speaker 1:58:31

If, if there was a ban on writing about how to be happy or how to be the, there's enough, there's already like, th like you said earlier, there's enough content out there right now, enough books that we can't, we'll never live long enough to read all these books, so please stop writing books about how to be happy. God. Yeah. Just be happy. Just be happy. Well, listen, man, let's wrap this up. Um, again, I just to circle back, I'm thrilled to have you on board full time as, as a cohost of this show. Um, I think you're going to bring a whole new, just every, you know, open up the world here and, uh, but I think between us and the guests that we're going to be able to bring on, hopefully be very entertaining and, and, and in short order, hopefully we'll, we'll pass up Joe Rogan's podcast. You know, he's only got 8 million subscribers, but, uh, you know, there's still, there's still room for, uh, for, for talk.

Speaker 3:59:35

I think that's right. And I'm, man, thank you for asking me to do this day. I am thrilled to be here. I think it's gonna get fascinating fast and we've already got some, some episodes in the can, as they say in the biz and uh, and there and, um, I'm excited about, I really, really excited about what we've already done and really thrilled about what we're going to do. So everybody, it,

Speaker 2:59:59

yeah, man. So check out our website, the groove podcast.com. I'm on Instagram most of the time, uh, at at Devin Pence on Instagram, I have my website as well. Devin pins.com also, if you'd like to help support our currently sponsoring this podcast, a join up on our patrionPage@patrion.com slash the groove podcast. You can check out our website for that link as well. Any love would be much appreciated and [inaudible] you want to tell them where they can find you. Again,

Speaker 3:1:0:31

I just, Reggie ham, R. E. G. I. E. H. a. M. M. it's spelled exactly the op. Both names are the opposite of what they're supposed to be. One G, two M's on Facebook. That's really kind of where I am most of the time. You can follow me on Twitter, but I don't tweet a lot. I find the Twitter verse to be a little bit hostile, but Facebook is kinda where it, that's kind of my jam, eh? Ah man. Another cliche, maybe we'll just roll on a roll. We've made it an even four, so there we go.

Speaker 2:1:1:01

All right guys, so that's it for this one and stay tuned. We're going to be releasing some, uh, interesting shows coming up. And, uh, looking forward to hearing from you. Reach out to us. Let us hear from you. And we will talk soon.

#thegroovepodcast, #stories, #podcast, #artists, #filmmakers, #devinpense, #regiehamm

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